Another Fjelstrup, Haderslev Translation Please

[Mike Jones]

Hello Again,

Wondering if someone would translate this record for me...

1737-1763 Fjelstrup, Haderslev, opslag 5, record number 10 for Jens M. Rodding.

Thanks

Mike Jones
USA

[Sofie Petersen]

Dear Mike!
I read:
Dom. 5 p. Trin. blef
Degnen Jens M. Rödding [his name is Rödding]
af Fjelstrup begrafvet og
hafde Kirckens Lyss paa
sig

Translation:
Dom. 5.p. Trin. was
the parish clerk Jens M. Rödding
of Fjelstrup buried and
had the candles of the church upon
him

Its is in old Danish, so the words are spelt in another way than nowadays. The other buried people also had the candles upon them, also children, so either everyone should have the candles, or maybe there was a grant for it. (One of the great farms in the parish should pay a part for a hearse, is told in Trap: Danmark, but I don´t see anything about candles). In other parishes one should pay for singing, candles and other functions. 
In opsl. 7 you will see something about the money his widow wanted. It is in German, with many legal terms, so I hope someone will take their time to translate and explain.
Kind regards, Sofie   

[Ralph Rasmussen]

Someone can probably render a transcription of the notice in opslag 7.

Long story short, the widow has requested pro rata payment for the portion of the year prior to his successor's appointment, and it is granted.

[Mike Jones]

Thank you for the translation and the continued help! 

Regards
Mike Jones

[Anne Ravnskjær]

I know a little about the widows life.

Translation with Google + small alteration:

Voldborg was born ca. 1702 pursuant funeral introduction from 1771 of Fjelstrup Kirkebog :
" Death 25 December Beg. 29 December Woldborg deceased Morten Nielsen formerly parish clerk to Gram church and Hedevig legitimate daughter , Married with Jens Michelsen parish deacon to Fjelstrup . Married 2 with Johan Jensen on a half yard in Fjelstrup . 69 years old , leaving two children Christina Hedevig and Marie Dorothea "
Voldborg was married 1 with parish clerk in Fjelstrup Jens Michelsen rodding around the 1735th He died already in 1737 and is buried in Fjelstrup 7 April : "Dom 5th post trinit . was clerk Jens M rodding of Fielstrup begrafet and Hafde Kierkens Lyyss on ... themselves . " Daughter Christina Hedevig is probably from this marriage . She is not to be found in Fjelstrup Kirkebog . As a widow marries Voldborg to 2 once with half farmer Johan Jensen approx . 1739th He dies 63 years old two years after Woldborg 29 November 1772nd He buried it. 6 December same year : " Johan Jensen deceased half yard man Jens Jepsen and Marie Jensis of Fjelstrup Genuine Son gifft with Woldborg deceased Jens Michelsen's widow in Fjelstrup . 63 years old , leaving one daughter Maria Dorothea . "


mvh

Anne R

[Ralph Rasmussen]

Anne has done the hard part, finding the relevant entries.  Further work on that Google rendering:

Voldborg was born ca. 1702 according to the funeral entry of 1771 of Fjelstrup parish register :
" Died 25 December, buried 29 December Woldborg, the late Morten Nielsen erstwhile parish clerk at Gram church and Hedevig's legitimate daughter. Married to Jens Michelsen parish deacon at Fjelstrup. Married then to Johan Jensen, who had a 'half' farm in Fjelstrup. 69 years old.  She leaves two children Christina Hedevig and Marie Dorothea "

Voldborg was married first with parish clerk in Fjelstrup Jens Michelsen rodding around the 1735. He died already in 1737 and is buried in Fjelstrup 7 April : "Dom 5th post trinit . was clerk Jens M rodding of Fielstrup begrafet and Hafde Kierkens Lyyss on ... themselves . "

Daughter Christina Hedevig is probably from this marriage . She is not to be found in Fjelstrup Kirkebog . As a widow marries Voldborg 'half' farmer Johan Jensen in about 1739. He dies 63 years old two years after Woldborg, 29 November 1772, and is buried there 6 December same year : "

Johan Jensen was the 'half' farm operator Jens Jepsen and Marie Jensis [Jensdatter] of Fjelstrup legitimate Son, and was married to Woldborg, the late Jens Michelsen's widow in Fjelstrup, 63 years old , [he] leaves one daughter Maria Dorothea . "

On the face of it, Christina Hedevig has died between 1770/1771 and 1772.

[Mike Jones]

Thanks Anne and Ralph for your help with my research.

Regards
Mike Jones

[Anne Ravnskjær]

I learned this about Christina Hedevig today from www.rudbeck.dk


CHRISTINA HEDEVIG2 Rødding (JENS MICHELSEN1 RØDDING) blev født omk. 1735, og døde 27 apr 1809 i Fjelstrup4.  Hun giftede sig med (1) RASMUS HANSEN.    Hun giftede sig med (2) JØRGEN RUDBECK 09 jul 1771 i Fjelstrup.  Han blev født 24 jun 1744 i Flovt4, og døde 22 okt 1813 i Fjelstrup4.

Noter for CHRISTINA HEDEVIG RØDDING:
Jørgen Rudbeck gift d.9/7-1771 i Fjelstrup med
Christina Hedwig Jensdatter, *ca. 1735, + 27/4-1809 i Fjelstrup.
Datter af degn Jens Mikkelsen og Waldborg Mortensdatter [Lihme] af Fjelstrup.
Christina Hedwig Jensdatter havde tidligere i 17 år været gift med Rasmus Hansen af Bygvraa4.

Notes
1.  Haderslev amt Fjelstrup sogn, 1737-1763 ops 5.
2.  Bodil Clausen, Gårde i Haderslev og Tyrstrup Herreder 1531-1753, Historisk Samfund for Sønderjylland, side 299.
3.  Haderslev amt Fjelstrup sogn, 1769-1783 opslag 350.
4.  Holger Rudbeck, Holger Rudbeck's hjemmesider.


Anne R

P.S. Mike; may I asked who you are looking for, maybe I can help.

[Mike Jones]

Hello Inger,

I thank you for your help...

I guess Jens Michelsen Rodding was married twice, first to Kirsten Jorgensdatter they had a daughter Else Jensdatter, who is my ancestor, I found her death record in the 1775-1786 Fjelstrup, opslag 81, number 17. It list her parents as noted above. So I was looking for a christening date for her, I cant see a age listed on the death record.
Else Jensdatter's husband death record Oluf Nissen, which is in the same book on opslag 74, number 9 list his age so I assume she was born around the same time.

Also if someone would be willing to translate the above two record for me. 

Regards and Thanks

Mike Jones
USA

[Sofie Petersen]

Dear Mike!

opsl nr. 81 nr. 17

Elsabe Olufs afdøde Degnen                      Elsabe Olufs [luf´s wife] the deceased parish clerk
Jens Michelsens af Fjelstrup                       Jens Michelsen´s of Fjelstrup
og Kirsten Jørgensdatters Datter               and Kirsten Jørgensdatter´s daughter
giftmed Oluf Nissen paa                             married to Oluf Nissen on
en Heelgaard i Fielstrup. Efterlader              a whole farm in Fielstrup. Leaves behind
2 Børn Sophia og Kjersten                         2 children Sophia and Kjersten

Opsl. 74 nr.9

Ole Nissen Heelgaardsmanden                    Ole Nissen the whole farm farmer
Nis Olesens and Sophia N. datters              Nis Olesen and Sophia N. Daughter´s
afKnud ægte søn gift med Elsabe Jens        of Knud their legitimate son married to Elsabe Jens
datter paa en heel Gaard i Fielstrup             daughter on a whole farm in Fielstrup
89 Aar gammel. Efterlader 2 Børn: Kjer       89 yrs. old. Leaves behind 2 children: Kjersten
sten og Sophia                                         and Sophia

Knud is a village in Fjelstrup parish.
A "helgaard" - "whole farm" is a bigger farm. There also could be half farms, eight-part- farms. So your ancestor was quite well-off! Kind regards, Sofie

[Mike Jones]

Hello,

I thank you for your help...

I guess Jens Michelsen Rodding was married twice, first to Kirsten Jorgensdatter they had a daughter Else Jensdatter, who is my ancestor, I found her death record in the 1775-1786 Fjelstrup, opslag 81, number 17. It list her parents as noted above. So I was looking for a christening date for her, I cant see a age listed on the death record.
Else Jensdatter's husband death record Oluf Nissen, which is in the same book on opslag 74, number 9 list his age so I assume she was born around the same time.

Also if someone would be willing to translate the above two record for me. 

Regards and Thanks

Mike Jones
USA

[Anne Ravnskjær]

Hi
Mike

I got something of your interest from the book "Gårde*1 i Haderslev og Tystrup herred*2 1531-1753" af Bodil Clausen. [*1 farms *2 county]

Page 299.

1724.
Jens Michelsen Rodding, clerk, ticket (penalty) for elligal cutting of firewood according to Maria church accountingbooks. 1707 is JM i debit with 15 skp.*  oats to the Maria Church, this means he could allready be running the fram. He gets i 1727 a loan of 100 mark [tinglæst]. 1729 K.jb [?]. Lease [The farm. Most likely a new contract] 1737 from the Maria Church. Dead 1737. 1698 in Fjelstrup church married to Kirsten Jensdatter [there is some inconsitance about the familyname] She is dead between 1728-1735. First daughter Else born 1699, she is named after fathersmother, Kirsten born 1703 named after mothersmother, Magdalene born 1706 she is married to Peter Christensen, Sillerup nr. 6. [refrence to another farm i the book]. 1716 the clerk gets the holy communion together with his wife, Marike and Else Jensdatter. Marike most be the oldest, becourse she is mention first. Most likely the sister of the wife.  
JMR was married 2. <=1735 with virgin Woldborg Lihme (sister to Otto Lihme to Keldet), born 1702 and dead 1771. At her funeral is mention that she is the daughter of Mortem Lihme, the clerk in a town called Gram, and Hedevig.

* old measurement of cereals

Anne R

[Anne Ravnskjær]

Hi

D=10: August blef min kiære Liden
(første) dater döbt, og opkaldet effter
min kiære Modre og kaldet Else ...

Gifve Hun maatte Væ(re) Stedse
Velsignet for Herren

The August 10 was my dear small
first daugther baptized, and named
after my beloved mother and called Else ...

Sure She forever will be
blessed by the Lord


The baby is the daughter of the priest. The text do not mention the name of the priest.

Anne R

The churchbook writer is not the priest but the clerk. You have found your ancester!! Her name is Elsabe. Else is the shortform of Elsabe and f. ex. Elisabeth.

Anne

[Mike Jones]

Thank you so much Anne for all the information 

Is that book  "Gårde*1 i Haderslev og Tystrup herred*2 1531-1753" online..

Thanks again
Mike Jones
USA

[Mike Jones]

Hi,

I was wondering if a more experienced eye look to see if the marriage of Jens Michelsen Rodding, the parish clerk and Kiersten Jorgensdatter or Jensdatter is listed in the 1698 marriages in Fjerstrup, Haderslev the marriages start on opslag 12.

Thanks a lot
Mike Jones
USA

[Anne Ravnskjær]

Hi

One cannot be sure about the marrige listed on opslag 12. On names mention.

But I am now sure that the churchbook is writen by the clerk - Jens M. Rodding. The marrige most by his and Kirsten Jensdatter (properble not Jørgensdatter). Bodil Clausen makes this conclussion too. JMR writes: July 28. I celebreted my wedding.

With good reason Bodil Clausen calls the wife Kirsten Jensdatter.

After Jens Roddings dead Woldborg Lihme married Johan Jensen - the Brother of Kirsten Jensdatter. In this way Johan Jensen becomes a WHOLE farmer = lease/process a Whole farm.

Bodil Clausens book is not on the internet. I send you page 299 as fil. I think it contens 3 or 4 generations of your ancesters.

Anne R

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

[Mike Jones]

Hi,

Thank you for the great information and all the help you have provided me with.

So if I understand, Kirsten Jensdatter the first wife of Jens Michelsen Rodding was the sister to Johan Jensen, and their father was Jens Jepsen...Or was the J.J. Muhlers the father of Kirsten Jensdatter?

I'm curious about the book, does this have information about Oluf Nissen the husband to Else Jensdatter, the daughter of Jens Michelsen Rodding?

Also, is it contain information on the Willad Jepsen family in Knud, Fjelstrup? Information about Willads Jepsen, states he was born around 1726 in Fjelstrup his parents were Jep Willadsen and Maria Fallesdatter.... he died August 23 1801 in Anslet, was married to Else Hansdatter, the daughter of Hans Madsen and Kirsten Olufsdatter. (Kirsten Olufsdatter is the daughter of Oluf Nissen and Else Jensdatter)

I thank you again for the great information and the great help you have given me.

Regards
Mike Jones
USA

[Anne Ravnskjær]

Hi

I think Kirsten was a Jens datter and the sister of Johan Jensen.

Why?

0. Jens Jepsen lease a WHOLE farm (nr. 9 en hel fastegard, kirkegods, marie Kirke, Haderslev)
1. Jens  Rodding had a HALF farm (nr. 9)
2. He was married to Kirsten Jensdatter
3. Johan Jensen is the son of Jens Jepsen.
4. Jens Roddings widow Woldborg Lihme married Johan Jensen. She had the half farm from her late husbond. This means Johan Jensen got/has now a WHOLE farm (nr. 9).

Conclusion: The (lease) farm is back in the Family and complet. An importen detail and the motivation in arrange marrige. I guess. Jens Rodding moved in to the half farm as he married kirsten and Voldborg married her nieghtbour Johan Jensen. All spekulation - but realistic.


I allso think the book contains information about the persones you mention. But I do not know and unfortunately I do not have Bodil Clausens book personaly. It sold out.

2-3 years ago I have borrowed the book at the library and copied the pages I had an interest in. Today, I have asked for the book again at the library. Just have to wait.

If you sendt an e-mail to me, I can return some information about BC's sources. If you place the cursor on my name the e-mail adr. will appear.


Anne R