Cannot find marriage, unsure which parish

[Erik Schaefer]

I'm trying to find the marriage of Peter Petersen Gellert (sometimes "Peder Pedersen" and sometimes "Gellert" is "Gelle" or "Gellerth") and Kirstin Michelsen (she was born Michelsdatter, but all other records have her as Michelsen).

Peter was born 06 Mar 1820 in Taps.  He died 15 Apr 1871  in Vamdrup, Vejle
I have Peter's birth, confirmation and death church records.  I have his census for 1835, but then no other censuses until 1860 and beyond.  I am missing his censuses for 1840, 1845 and 1850.

Kirstin was born 24 Jun 1833 in Hjarup, Vejle.  She died 26 Nov 1894 in Vamdrup, Vejle
I have all census and church records for Kirstin. She lived with her parents on the 1850 census, but with her husband Peter in 1860

I know that Peter and Kirstin had a daughter in 1859 in Vamdrup named Agnes Hedevig Gellert, and the three of them appear on the 1860 census in Vamdrup, Vejle.  On Agnes Hedevig's birth record in 1859 both Peter and Kirstin are listed as the parents.

So based upon what I know above, I would suspect they would have married between 1850 (when Kirstin was with her parents in Hjarup) and 1859 (when their daughter was born in Vamdrup).  I checked the records for Taps, Vamdrup, and Hjarup and could not locate their marriage between 1850-1860.

It is quite possible I overlooked them somehow, especially in the Vamdrup books which are hard to read.  My research is indicating that Peter may have been Kirstin's uncle, which would make this marriage very interesting. 

If someone could locate this church record I would be most grateful.  It would prove or disprove my theory that they were uncle and niece.

[Erik Schaefer]

Forgot Peter was living with his brother Rasmus on the 1845 census.   But I dont know where he was in 1850.

[Kirsten Tatt]

name: Agnes Hedevig Petersen Gellert
gender: Female
baptism/christening date: 09 Jun 1855
baptism/christening place: , VAMDRUP, RIBE, DENMARK
father's name: Peter Gellert
mother's name: Kirsten Mikkelsen
indexing project (batch) number: C20778-4

Opslag 32



Agnes Hedevig dies 7 Jan 1857

Opslag 146

Venlig hilsen Kirsten

[Jane C]

1845
Vejle, Nørre Tyrstrup, Taps, Skovrup, Gaard, 70, FT-1845, b8231
Rasmus Petersen Gellert 42 Gaardmand og Kirkeværge born in Taps
Anne Maria Jesdatter 30 Gift Hustrue born in Fjelstrup
Peter Rasmussen Gellert 7 Barn
Maria Gellert 2 Barn
Peter Gellert 25 Ugift Husf. Broder og Avlskarl born in Taps
Maria Schulz 68 Enke Huusf. Moder. Aftægtskone born in Tyrstrup
6 Tjenestefolk.....

[Jane C]

Based on the information below it is likely that Peter Petersen Gellert married the daughter (Kirsten) of his sister Agnes Gellert (who married Michel Thomsen).

So you are looking for the original documents to verify this.

Thought I'd post all this to help searchers! I didn't see a marriage record for Peter and Kirsten when I looked.

Peter Rasmussen GELLERT
Born 09 Dec 1770 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
Died 29 JUN 1836 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
His Father: Rasmus Petersen GELLERT b: 28 SEP 1743 in Høkkelbjerg Kro, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
His Mother: Dorthea ANKERSDATTER b: 20 JUL 1748 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
His Wife:  Maria Catharina SCHULTZ b: 18 JAN 1778 in Tyrstrup, Haderslev Amt, Schleswig
Peter and Maria married: 1 JUL 1797 in Taps Church, Taps, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
Children of Peter Rasmussen Gellert and Maria Schultz:
1. Dorthe GELLERT b: 9 SEP 1799 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
2. Woldborg GELLERT b: 30 NOV 1801 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
3. Rasmus Petersen GELLERT b: 2 JAN 1804 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
4. Matthias GELLERT b: 13 APR 1807 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
5. Agnes GELLERT b: 23 FEB 1810 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
6. Hans GELLERT b: 11 MAR 1814 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig
7. Peter GELLERT b: 6 MAR 1820 in Skovrup, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig

Kirsten Michaelsdatter in census (married Peter Petersen Gellert b. 1820 in Skovrup, Taps)

1834
Ribe, Anst, Hjarup, Hjarup by, En gård, 33, FT-1834, C3041
Michal Thomassen 33
Agnes Hedevig Gellert 24 [born about 1810, per 1850 census born in Taps Sogn, see below]
Kirsten Michalsdatter 1
Thomas Michalsen 61 Enke Aftægtsmand hos husfaderen
Mette Kirstine Thomasdatter 20 Hans Datter

1840
Ribe, Anst, Hjarup, Hjarup Bye og Sogn, en Gaard, 14, FT-1840, C8148
Michel Thomsen 39 Gift Gaardmand og Sognefoged
Agnes Hedevig Gellert 30
Kirsten Michelsen 8 Deres Børn
Marie Catrine Michelsen 5
Marie Michelsen 3
Thomas Michelsen 1
etc

1850
Ribe, Anst, Hjarup, Hjarup, en Gaard, 33, FT-1850, C4128
Michel Thomsen 49 Gaardmd, Huusfader I Sognet
Agnes Hedvig Geller 40 Taps, Haderslev A.
Kirsten Michelsen 17 [all children born in Hjarup Sogn]
Marie Katrine Michelsen 15
Marie Michelsen 13
Peder Michelsen 9
Thomas Michelsen 7
Niels Thomsen Michelsen 1

1860
Ribe, Anst, Vamdrup, Øster Vamdrup, En Gaard, 62, FT-1860, D5261
Peder Gellert 40 Gift Gaardmand. Huusfader Taps Sogn Haderslev Amt
Kirsten født Mikkelsdatter 27 hans Kone Hjarup Sogn Ribe Amt
Agnes Hedevig Pedersen Gellert 2 Ugift deres Datter Vamdrup
2 Tjenestepige 1 Tjenestekarl

Children of Peter Petersen Gellert and Kirsten Michelsdatter:

[#1] Agnes Hedevig Petersen Gellert christened 09 Jun 1855  dies 07 Jan 1857

[#2] Agnes Hedevig Pedersen Gellert christened 06 Jan 1859 Vamdrup, Anst, Ribe

[#3] Mikkel Thomsen Petersen Gellert  christened 06 Nov 1864 Vamdrup, Anst, Ribe
Parents Peter Petersen Gellert and Kirsten Mikkelsdr

1880
Ribe, Anst, Vamdrup, Øster Vamdrup, Gaard, 184, FT-1880, D4651
Laurits Eriksen Kugger
Kirsten Kugger født Mikkelsen 46 Hans Hustrue I Sognet [Vamdrup Sogn]
Mikkel Thomsen Gellert 15 Husfaderens Stedsøn I Sognet [Vamdrup Sogn]
etc

[Jane C]

1835
Vejle, Nørre Tyrstrup, Taps, Schaurup, 6, Hufengebäude, 78, FT-1835, D2090
Peter Rasmussen 65 Hufner
Maria Catharina Matztochter 57 seine Frau
Rasmus Petersen Gellert 32 ihre Kinder
Hans Gellert 21 ihre Kinder
Peter Gellert 15 ihre Kinder

1803
Vejle, Nørre Tyrstrup, Taps, Schaurup, , 3, FT-1803, b8119
Peter Rasmussen 33 Hufner
Maria Catharine Schulz 25
Dorthe Rasmussen 4
Wolborg Rasmussen 2
[this is the family to Peter Petersen Gellert]

[Jane C]

From an Ancestry tree
Peter Petersen Gellert b. 1820 in Taps sogn has a grandmother named Agnes Hedevig Asmusdatter.
Agnes was born in Høkkelbjerg Kro, Taps Sogn, Vejle Amt, Schleswig Jun 1708 to Asmus Asmussen and Heilvig Catharina Kopke. Married Peter Petersen Gellert (the elder). D 10 Oct 1790 in Høkkelbjerg Kro.

Thus "Agnes Hedevig" is a family name for Peter (b. 1820) as well as for Kirsten (Kirsten's mother Agnes Hedevig).

[Erik Schaefer]

Many thanks for the help so far.

To Kirsten Tatt:  Thank you, I was unaware of their first Agnes Hedevig.  So this means if they married it would have been between 1850-1855 so that will narrow the search a little.

To Jane Christiansen:  Thank you.  I have all of those records and I was too tired to paste them all last night.  I should have taken the time to do that and help others.  Thank you so much. 

I will check out the ancestry.com tree and see how he knows this information.  It must be Peter Petersen Gellert's maternal grandmother (which I don't have in my tree).  His paternal grandmother was Dorthe Ankersdatter which was the name given to me just the other day on this forum when I asked for help on a record. 

So it seems I have half an answer.  It is likely they were uncle/niece, but it also appears that there is no official marriage record of the two (at least not in the three parishes I had mentioned Vamdrup, Hjarup, and Taps).

Not the closure I had hoped for, but it's nice to know my research was not wrong, and Peter and Kirsten were related.

[Erik Schaefer]

Jane I think I found the ancestry tree you mention.  If it is the same, then actually Agnes Hedvig Asmusdatter would be Peter Petersen Gellert's Great Grandmother.  I think you were just off slightly because of the similarity in names between Peter Rasmussen Gellert and his son Peter Petersen Gellert.

As I mentioned I have Dorthe Ankersdatter and her husband Rasmus Petersen Gellert already in my tree so I think this gives me good leads.  I will search the church books for the proof now.

Thank you again.

PS - If Agnes Hedvig is a family name for Peter, it would also be for Kirstin since they are uncle/niece   (Or was that the point you were trying to make?)   

I love this forum.  You guys are the best.

[Jane C]

"PS - If Agnes Hedvig is a family name for Peter, it would also be for Kirstin since they are uncle/niece   (Or was that the point you were trying to make?)--Erik"

Yup, Erik, that was the point I was making. Although we/you haven't yet found all the original church records to verify all this, the many clues (including that name Agnes Hedvig) make it close to impossible that Peter and Kirstin are not uncle and niece!

Yes - Agnes Hedvig Asmusdatter would be Peter Petersen Gellert's great-grandmother. I tripped over a "great"!

: D

[Erik Schaefer]

Well I checked again today for the church record of their marriage bet 1850-1855 in Taps, Hjarup and Vamdrup and I just don't see it.

Is it possible they never officially married?  I have seen other birth records where the church will list if the mother was unwed when the child was born, but maybe someone lied or the church overlooked the fact that they never married?  I don't know...I'm stumped.

This bit of my family history is a mystery, both Peter and Kirstin died before my great grandmother was born and so she probably never knew the truth (if she did, she never told my grandmother, because this was a shock to her).