Forfatter Emne: Uautoriserede Folketællinger  (Læst 83959 gange)

Arne Feldborg

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« Svar #120 Dato: 15 Okt 2014 - 10:04 »
Som meddelt andet steds har vi netop publiceret en del af Holger Hertzums materiale på slaegtogdata.dk. Herunder også:
Folketælling Holstebro 1748
Folketælling Kolding 1735
Folketælling Ribe 1748
Folketælling Ringkøbing 1748
Folketælling Varde 1748

Se:
https://www.slaegtogdata.dk/kilder/afskrevne-kilder/bidrag-fra-holger-hertzum-larsen
mvh. Arne Feldborg
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Arne Feldborg

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« Svar #121 Dato: 17 Nov 2014 - 19:59 »
Fra et medlem har vi fået oplysning om en tælling fra året 1717 for Raabjerg sogn i Hjørring amt.

Tællingen kaldes "Pastor Myginds mandtalsliste for Råbjerg sogn i 1717" men har nærmere karakter af en egentlig folketælling.
Listen kan ses her:
http://www.engbaek.com/familien/steder/raabjerg1717.pdf

Tællingen er iøvrigt også afleveret til DDA under Kip-nummeret B3508, men så vidt jeg kan se er den ikke søgbar dér.
« Senest redigeret: 17 Nov 2014 - 20:11 af Arne Feldborg [6966] »
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Flemming Willum Petersen

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« Svar #122 Dato: 17 Nov 2014 - 22:14 »
Tak for den Arne

Eftersom du er webmaster regner jeg med du opdaterer listen?
Forsker pt. i slægten Svendsen Smed i Halsted/Avnede. Dertil søges altid oplysninger om glarmestre/rakkere på Lolland og Sjælland.

Arne Feldborg

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« Svar #123 Dato: 18 Nov 2014 - 11:47 »
Ja, det er sket.

Og det er måske også på tide, at vi lige gentager linket til siden:
https://www.slaegtogdata.dk/kilder/ekstraordinaere-folketaellinger
mvh. Arne Feldborg
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A-M Jørgensen

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« Svar #124 Dato: 08 Dec 2015 - 13:43 »

Måske det er off topic her men jeg faldt over noget i dag som overraskede helt vildt, om hvad
det offentlige registrerer.

http://www.rougsoe.lokalarkiver.dk/

scroller man helt ned i bunden ses:

Kommunearkiv:
Ikke alle kommuner har et kommunearkiv, - det har Norddjurs kommune.
 Her er alt kommunalt arkivmateriale placeret, såsom skoleprotokoller, fattiggårdsprotokoller m.m.
 Arkivmateriale fra Gl. Rougsø kommune er at finde på det gamle rådhus i Allingåbro.
 Ønsker du at besøge kommunearkivet, skal du kontakte Grenå Arkiv, tlf.:   89 59 27 72, mail:  arkivet@norddjurs.dk
 for at lave en aftale.
 Se oversigt  her

Hvis man klikker på oversigten, får man en  92 siders PDF-fil med ALT
børn u. f. ægteskab
hundeprotokoller
mandtalslister
skattelister
og mere som jeg ikke havde fantasi til. Det er desværre ikke digitaliseret.

vh Anne-Marie

Bjarne Smedegaard

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« Svar #125 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 15:51 »
Dejligt med et link til listen!

Kan man ikke lægge linket ind øverst i tråden også?

Der er så mange svar på denne tråd, at det er meget tidskrævende at læse det hele igennem,
men på listen kunne jeg hurtigt se at jeg har fundet en ny tilføjelse:

Svostrup sogn, Hids herred, Viborg amt, 1830
Grønbæk sogn, Lysgaard herred, Viborg amt 1830


kilde:
sa.dk, Enesteministerialbog, 1795 - 1813
(samme bog ligge både under Svostrup og Grønbæk, da det er samme pastorat)

opslag 1, indholdsfortegnelse: side 95: optegnelse for folkemængden 1830

op. 161 = side 88
op. 163 = side 101
op. 162 = side 100 (unummereret venstre side) Opsumering af folketællingen, dateret 4. jan 1831.

Folketællingen er altså ikke lagt på nettet.
Er den mon overhovedet scannet?

Kun den sidste side (100), med antal indbyggere er kommet med.

hilsen Bjarne Smedegaard
 

Arne Feldborg

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« Svar #126 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 16:29 »
Folketællingen er altså ikke lagt på nettet.
Er den mon overhovedet scannet?

Kun den sidste side (100), med antal indbyggere er kommet med.
Det er jo ikke en officiel folketælling, og den bliver næppe nogensinde lagt på nettet som en sådan.

Det er jo, som der også stå på siden, en opgørelse over folketallet. Og den eller de lister der evt. ligger til grund for sammentællingen findes næppe længere. Ihvertfald findes bogen både i den gamle og den nye skanning, men ingen af stederne er siderne Folio 89 til 95 med. 
« Senest redigeret: 18 Dec 2015 - 16:35 af Arne Feldborg [185] »
mvh, a.f.
http://hammerum-herred.dk/
Ved evt. direkte henvendelse til mig: Brug venligst e-mail, ikke "Personlig besked", tak.

Bjarne Smedegaard

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« Svar #127 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 20:03 »

Det er jo ikke en officiel folketælling, og den bliver næppe nogensinde lagt på nettet som en sådan.

Nej, det er korrekt. Det er en Optegnelse over folkemængden i 1830, som præsten bruger 6 sider i kirkebogen på. Fra 95 til og med side 100, hvor man på side 100 kan læse at der er:
672 indbyggere i Grønbæk og 519 indbyggere i Svostrup, ialt 1191 prs. i provstiet. (5 sider mangler)

Egon Hansen

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« Svar #128 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 20:38 »
Hvis du kan finde ud af hvilket nummer den gamle M-film, altså den vi brugte før microkortenes tid, kan (eller kunne engang !) bestille den på Daysy til brug på RA's læsesal!
Nå nej, når du kender til siderne, har du jo den allerede, men til glæde for os andre!
Mvh Egon

Arne Feldborg

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« Svar #129 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 20:52 »
Sandsynligheden taler vel for at teksten på folio 100 er en fortsættelse af noget der har stået på een af de foregående sider.

Men om det også gælder de øvrige manglende sider, og om disse overhovedet er bevarede i den originale bog, kan vi ikke vide. Ihvertfald er de ikke skannet i hverken den gamle eller den nye serie.
mvh, a.f.
http://hammerum-herred.dk/
Ved evt. direkte henvendelse til mig: Brug venligst e-mail, ikke "Personlig besked", tak.

Egon Hansen

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« Svar #130 Dato: 18 Dec 2015 - 21:35 »
Jeg kender ikke den aktuelle kirkebog, men jeg har forsket så mange år på RA at jeg hat brugt de gamle mormonfilm, og jeg har enkelte numre stående i mine notater, og selv om der engang i Daysy stod "film uden indhold" kunne det altså lade sig gøre at se sider fra gamle kirkebøger som ikke var medtaget på mocrokortene! (og tilsyneladende heller ikke på indscandingerne til nettet)
Jeg har for flere år siden givet et eksempel fra sådan en film i dette forum, selv om sidens opri8ndelige idemand dengang ikke mente at mit indlæg opfyldte kravene til en "uautoriseret folketællingsliste", så mon ikke den skulle stå her stadig ?
Det var bare lige det jeg mente med at "nogen" som engang havde læst de pågældende sider burde komme med de gamle filmnumre! for de originale bøger er jo lukket land, ellers ville de forlængst være slidt til laser.

mvh Egon.

Lars Tyge Jørgensen

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« Svar #131 Dato: 08 Maj 2016 - 13:59 »
Forleden dukkede nedenstående op på min Facebookside.

Jeg synes det fortjener en lidt større udbredelse så her er hvad Kim Melchor skrev:

"THE DANISH CENSUS ALMOST NOBODY KNEW ABOUT"
KIM MELCHIOR·2. MAJ 2016

Usually when we speak about census records from Denmark, we say they start in 1787, which was the year the first census covering the whole country was completed. However, there are some examples of other censuses, which may only cover a smaller area such as a town or a very localized area . One of these censuses is from the island of Møn and was completed in 1644. It was to be used as a base for a head tax levied in 1645 for the whole island. Miraculously the census has survived for five out of the six parishes on the island, in addition to the actual tax lists. The census has been hidden in obscurity for many years, collecting dust on the shelves of the National Archive in Copenhagen, Denmark. Only a handful of local researchers have been aware of its existence. Therefore, it has not been recognized and utilized as the great resource it is for the genealogists who are searching for their ancestors on Møn. This is a very important Danish census because of the years covered. It goes hand in hand with the Lutheran church records from five of the six parishes on the island, which also began during the same time period, namely: Borre beginning in 1645, Elmelunde beginning in 1630, Keldby beginning in 1682, Magleby beginning in 1645 and Stege beginning in 1661. This census has great genealogical value. While the tax lists basically only give names, there is a lot of additional information to be gleaned from the census. It lists whole family groups, with the information varying from parish to parish. Information such as names, ages and family relationships can be found for the majority of the households on Møn. Many of these families can be traced in the church registers from the island. For example in the census for Borre parish, the names were listed for all residents of the parish along with their positions in the households. Ages were only listed for the children and servants, never for the head of household or his wife. In the census for Magleby the names were listed for the head of the household along with the names of the children and the servants, but the names of the wives were never recorded. The census of Fanefjord parish upon which the tax list was based did not survive. Only the tax list from this parish still exists. No children under the age of 15 are listed in the tax list, so we do not get a picture of complete families from this parish as we do from the rest of the parishes on the rest of the island. Nobody knows exactly how many people were living on the island of Møn in 1644, but the census gives us a very good idea. There are a total of 1,581 people listed on the census records. They are distributed as follows: 1) Borre: 634 people 2) Elmelunde: 365 people 3) Fanefjord: (Taxlist) 415 people 4) Keldby: 505 people 5) Magleby: 740 people 6) Stege: 2,523 people Not everyone in the parish was listed because the tax was not paid on everyone. There were some people who did not have to pay the head tax. An example of people who did not have to pay were some of the older inhabitants. They may or may not be listed in the census. It was totally up to the census taker (the minister of the parish) to decide who was to be included. The following is an example of a family group taken from the original census of the village of Budsemarke in Magleby parish: Peder Smed His wife Anna Pedersdatter 2 child Kirsten Andersdatter 11 Stepdaughter There is actually a lot more information than what initially meets the eye. Much can be inferred from the entry. We have the husband Peder Smed with his wife and their two children, one of which actually is a stepchild of Peder. The name of his wife is not given, but we can assume that she had been married before to a man named Anders. We come to this conclusion based on the information given about the older daughter Kirsten Andersdatter. The patronymic naming system was used in Denmark during this time period. This means that the surname of a man was created by adding a "sen" to the first name of his father. If it was the surname of a woman it would also be created from the first name of her father, but the word "datter" would be added rather than "sen." So in this case Kirsten was literally the daughter of Anders. We can also assume that the marriage between Peder Smed and his wife took place sometimes between 1633 and 1642 based on the ages of the children in the family. But it gets better than that. Because the church records for Magleby parish began in 1645 we do have the ability to glean additional information from this other source. By reading hrough the burial registers from 1645 forward, we find that Peder Smed from Budsemarke also was known as Peder Hansen Smed. We know this because that is how he was listed when he was buried. By doing a closer reading on the christening records for Magleby parish, and especially paying attention to the witnesses who were listed in connection with the christenings, we find that the wife of Peder Smed was Inger. Based on these findings we now have the enhanced entry: Peder Hansen Smed - Husband Inger - Wife Anna Pedersdatter 2 Daughter Kirsten Andersdatter 11 Stepdaughter Now let us take a look at another family found in the census. This one selected from the village of Nyborre in Borre parish:
Mads Rasmussen - Husband Thyra Hemmingsdatter - Wife Hans Jensen 11 Stepson Hemming Madsen 8 Son Sidsel Madsdatter 10 Daughter Bodil Madsdatter 3 Daughter Here we have a family group consisting of husband, wife and four children including a stepson. Based on the given information we can assume that the wife probably had been married before. We know her first husband would have been named Jens, again based on the surname of the oldest child (Jensen, the son of Jens). We can also reason that her first husband died somewhere between 1632 and 1634 based on the ages of the two older children. Hans, the son of Jens being 11 years old and Sidsel, the daughter of Mads being 10 years old. We can deduct that Thyra Hemmingsdatter remarried very quickly after the death of Jens because Sidsel was born about one year after Hans was born. From the information listed above we can figure that Mads and Thyra got married somewhere around 1633/1634. The parish registers for Borre parish began in 1645. By reading through the burial records from Borre parish register we find that Mads Rasmussen also was known as Mads Rasmussen Saxe because this is how he was listed at the time of his death and burial. His age was also listed at the time of his burial. By use of simple math we can now calculate how old he would have been in 1644. We can do the same for Thyra, because her age was also listed at her burial. Now we can compile the enhanced entry based on the known facts and information from other sources as: Mads Rasmussen Saxe 30 Husband Thyra Hemmingsdatter 41 Wife Hans Jensen 11 Stepson Hemming Madsen 8 Son Sidsel Madsdatter 10 Daughter Bodil Madsdatter 3 Daughter The information from the census helped me add a new generation to my pedigree chart and also gave me the names of the siblings of Hemming. Before I found the 1645 tax list all I knew was that Hemming was born about 1636 based on his age at death. I knew his father's name was Mads, but I did not know which one of several men named Mads, who were living in Borre parish during this time period, was his father. I was also able to establish that Thyra Hemmingsdatter had been married to a man named Jens before she married Mads Rasmussen. I became aware of this record during a research trip to Denmark several years ago. I visited the small local historical archive in the town of Stege, with the hopes that I could ferret out some sort of records which were not readily available through the Family History Library in Salt Lake City. One of the local researchers with whom I spoke mentioned the 1645 tax lists in our conversation. He made references to several people, along with their ages and told me that he had obtained this information from the 1645 tax lists. When I inquired where the census/tax lists were located I was told at the National Archive in Copenhagen. After my return to the States, I was able to obtain a copy of the complete tax list through a researcher in Copenhagen. I entered the complete list for each parish into a word processing document, did some additional research, and entered all the new information I could obtain from various other sources as well. The result of this work is a six volume set (one volume from each parish) of books, which contains the complete census and/or tax list from the island of Møn. There are four sections in each book: 1) The list of names as they were taken from the original record. 2) The same list as mentioned above but with additional information obtained from other sources. 3) An alphabetic index of every person listed in the census. 4) Copies of the original tax and/or census lists. The lists in these books are easier to utilize than the original lists, mainly because they are in a printed format rather than the old Gothic script, which can be difficult to read. These books are now included in the Danish Collection at the Family History Library in Salt Lake City. These lists are extremely useful to anybody having ancestors on the island of Møn. I have been able to add more than 300 people to my personal database because of the information obtained from these lists. In many instances I had an idea that certain people were related but I could not prove it. Now with the additional information found in the census/tax lists I have proof that they do indeed belong to the family. The books have the following call numbers in the Family History Library system: Borre: 948.915/B1 X2m Elmelunde: 948.915/E1 X2m Fanefjord: 948.915/F1 X2m Keldby: 948.915/K1 X2m Magleby: 948.915/M1 X2m Stege: 948.915 X2m

Kim Melchior, Accredited Genealogist, was born in Denmark. He is accredited by the International Commission for the Accreditation of Professional Genealogists (ICAPGen) in Danish research and has done professional research in Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Finland for more than thirty years. He has also worked as a Reference Assistant at the Scandinavian Reference Counter in the Family History Library in Salt Lake City. He has the following web page: Scandinaviangenealogy.com.

Kim Melchior can be reached either by mail: 70 North Western View Dr, Cedar City UT 84721 or by phone: 435-531-6767 or by e-mail at Scandinaviangenealogy@infowest.com

Lars Tyge Jørgensen

Kim Melchior

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« Svar #132 Dato: 31 Aug 2016 - 05:56 »
Hej,

Den artikel der er ovenfor paa engelsk er blevet oversat og forventes gengivet paa dansk i det nye nummer af Slaegt og Data der udkommer i september.

Mvh,

Kim Melchior (USA)

Lene Søgaard Pedersen

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« Svar #133 Dato: 07 Feb 2017 - 11:00 »
Mantalsliste 1818 i Ålborg amt, Als sogn KB 1780-1813 opsl. 99

Præsten skriver:
Sogneliste for Als sogn, Aalborg amt forfattet d. 20. maj 1818 over alt det mandtal fra 20 aars begyndelse til det 50 aars fyldte har erholdt sig i Als sogn og iflg. forordning af 26. febr. 1808 henhører til ???

Hilsen Lene

Anne Messmann

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« Svar #134 Dato: 05 Mar 2017 - 13:48 »
Kirkebog for Allerslev, Voldborg, Roskilde starter først år 1800. Derfor leder jeg efter andre kilder, og stødte på denne fra RA, Daisy under Ledreborg Gods:

Optegnelser over Allesløv Sogns beboere (1789-1789)

Indholdet beskrives ikke nærmere. Jeg finder den ikke her under: Kilder, Extraord. Folketællinger.
Findes den mon hos DIS eller et andet sted, eller skal man en tur på Rigsarkivet, for at kigge på den?

Venlig hilsen
Anne Messmann
Med venlig hilsen
Anne Messmann
www.annemessmann.dk

Arne Feldborg

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mvh. Arne Feldborg
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Lene Søgaard Pedersen

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Ringkøbing amt, Sevel sogn FT 1768
« Svar #136 Dato: 07 Sep 2017 - 22:36 »
Ringkøbing amt, Ginding, Sevel, 1769-1804 FKVD (EM) - opslag 3

http://ao.salldata.dk/vis1.php?bsid=168658&side=3

Hilsen Lene

Toke b

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« Svar #137 Dato: 30 Aug 2018 - 21:33 »
Med inspiration fra tråden "Folketælling 1830" startet af Jan Andersen, hvor han efterlyser en  folketælling af Store Heddinge Købstad i 1830, vil jeg hermed starte en tråd, hvor jeg vil opfordre folk til at bidrage med oplysninger om fundne uautoriserede folketællinger, hvor de end måtte være nedskrevet.

Dette vil forhåbentlig lette arbejdet for mange slægtsforskere.

Her vil jeg godt lægge ud med at fortælle at jeg i Maribo Amt, Lollands Sønder Herred, Stokkemarke Sogn KB 1812-1814 er stødt på en af præsten udført folketælling over Stokkemarke Sogn i året 1814.

Dertil er af Lene Søgaard Pedersen i tråden "Folketælling 1830" oplyst at der findes en folketælling over Bringstrup Sogn i 1822 i kirkebogen for Bringstrup-Sigersted (Sigersted er ikke inkluderet i folketællingen)

Se også:
https://www.slaegtogdata.dk/kilder/ekstraordinaere-folketaellinger


Spændende læsning tak for link

Mikkel Eide Eriksen

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« Svar #138 Dato: 18 Sep 2019 - 16:25 »
Hej!

Fandt i dag et spændende "Åsyns-tingsvidne" fra 1715, hvor tilsyneladende alle Musse herreds beboelser opremses med overhovede, gårdens/husets størrelse og stand, besætning, og navngivne sønner med alder (helt ned til 4 år eller yngre)!

Jeg har lagt hele tingsvidnet her:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1HKPVjRs0Y3LKBoH2e0Cqp68rq5qvSLZO?usp=sharing

Der var i pakken også et tilsvarende fra 1716 som jeg dog ikke kiggede nærmere på.

mvh
Mikkel
Forsker pt. i Lindberg (Sverige/Kbh), Svane (Mors), Behringer (Alsace/Kbh/Bergen), Bortvig/Fleischer (Lolland/Falster). Desuden Gilleleje & Rågeleje generelt.

Kontakt: mikkel.eriksen@gmail.com