Forfatter Emne: Help locating a mother  (Læst 383 gange)

Matthew Dent

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 51
Help locating a mother
« Dato: 26 Nov 2019 - 23:19 »
Sorry, edited because I accidentally posted before finishing.

Hello,

I have come across a confusing situation. I am working on the family of Christen Andersen (1741-1809) from Dronninglund, Hjørring. His appearance in the 1787 census lists him as being married to a Birgitte Pedersdatter (c. 1739-?) and living with his two children Jens (1770-1821) and Simon (1773-1854). However, in the birth records for the sons I see the mother is named Birthe Pedersdatte. Furthermore, in 1801, Simon is suddenly listed as the "husbands second son". This is where I've become confused, is it possible that Birthe and Birgitte are the same people? Does the 1801 census imply that Birgitte is not the mother to the children in the household? My hypothesis was that if there was a separate person named Birthe she must have died in Dronninglund prior to the 1787 census but after the birth of Simon. Unfortunately, hours looking through the church book for the time period hasn't netted me any information.

Hjørring, Dronninglund, Dronninglund, Tolstrup Bye, Nørgaard, 125, FT-1787, B2970
Navn:                        Alder:    Status:    Stilling i familien:    Erhverv:                         Fødested:
Christian Andersen            46        Gift             husbond           bonde og gaardbeboer      
Birgitte Pedersdatter         48        Gift           madmoder           
Jens Christensen            15        barn           
Simon Christensen            13        barn           
Svend Madsen                    26        Ugift          tjenestekarl 

Hjørring, Dronninglund, Dronninglund, Tolstrup Bye, -, 129, FT-1801, B4744
Navn:     Alder:    Status:    Stilling i familien:    Erhverv:    Fødested:
Christen Andersen     58     Gift     Huusbonde     Bonde og Gaardbeboer      
Birgitte Pedersdatter     60?     Gift     hans Kone     -      
Jens Christensen     31     Gift     deres Søn     -      
Johane Jensdatter     25     Gift     dennes Kone [Jens Christensen]     -      
Christen Jensen     2     Ugift     disses Søn     -      
Simon Christensen     29     Ugift     Huusbondens anden Søn     -      
Christen Thomsen     15     Ugift     Tjenestekarl     -      
Maren Thomasdatter     20     Ugift     Tjenestepige     -      

Record 32, Jens Christensen baptism
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?bsid=161009#161009,27052089

Record 1, Simon Christensen baptism
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?bsid=161009#161009,27052122

« Senest redigeret: 26 Nov 2019 - 23:24 af Matthew Dent »
- Matthew

Grethe Leerbech

  • Medlem
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 1.034
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #1 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 11:46 »
Hi Matthew. The remark "husbondens andens son" husbands second son means only that he is the second of birth or He is the next oldest son. Nothing about another mother.
And Birgitte and Birthe is the same person. At that time rthe spelling of names etc. were very confusing because there was no strict rules of spelling - or rules at all (nearly). Also it could be, that she called herself Birthe it was easier than Birgitte -which in that periode in that class and that area is a seldom name.
Have you found her birth?

greetings
Grethe .
Thyholm,Vang, Gislum,Hornum,Hindsted, Slet, Års i Aalborg a. Ginding,Ringkøbing a.Rinds, Fjends,Hindborg,Viborg a. Nybøl, Sottrup,Sønderbog a.sogne i Tyskland, Sunds,Svendborg a.Tuse,Års,Løve i Holbæ

Matthew Dent

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 51
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #2 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 13:26 »
Thank you! I haven't been able to find her birth in Dronninglund in that time period, but it could very well be that I've just missed it. Those old books really make me strain my eyes...
- Matthew

Matthew Dent

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 51
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #3 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 15:34 »
Ok, I've found her death. Number 16.
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?bsid=410870#410870,75932053

I found a birth record that's pretty darn close but I don't know if it's her or not. Number 4 on the right:
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?bsid=161006#161006,27051508
- Matthew

Christian Sander Petersen

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 40
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #4 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 20:44 »
Hi Matthew.

It seems to be the correct death record you found, since it says "widow after Christen Andersen in Tolstrup". The age in the death record is hard to read, at first glance it looks like it says 98 years, which would be a very high age in 1826 (and would also mean she was born around 1728), but it looks like the 9 was changed to something else, maybe an 8. If she was 88 when she died in 1826, which still would be a quite high age, she was born around 1738, which could match 1739.

Regarding the birth record, I can simply not decipher what it says. Have you tried finding the marriage record for Christen and Birgitte? It might say who Birgitte's parents are.

Matthew Dent

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 51
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #5 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 21:35 »
It looks like it was changed to 88, which makes sense. Unfortunately, unless I'm missing something, the marriage records for 1758-1777 in Dronninglund sogn are not scanned/missing.
- Matthew

Christian Sander Petersen

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 40
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #6 Dato: 27 Nov 2019 - 22:23 »
Marriage records for 1749-1808 for Dronninglund Sogn can be found here:

https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17122208#161008,27051875

The "V" in the file stands for "vielser", Danish for marriages. In the church book it might also be written as "corpulerede" or "ægteviede". But unless you have some vague idea about when they got married, it's gonna be a a very tiresome process :)


Matthew Dent

  • Bruger
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 51
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #7 Dato: 28 Nov 2019 - 00:15 »
Luckily, I have "getting through grad school" levels of patience, haha. Yeah this is the book I've looked in. The table of contents at the beginning only says marriages before 1758 and after 1777. I flipped through it and it's just blank after 1758, the next page is 1777. Seems there are some pages missing or destroyed. I mean, unless I'm completely blind because sometimes these images are a bit out of order...
- Matthew

Grethe Leerbech

  • Medlem
  • Bruger med indlæg
  • Indlæg: 1.034
Sv: Help locating a mother
« Svar #8 Dato: 29 Nov 2019 - 12:39 »
Unfortunately Matthew. You are right the marriages from 1758 to 1777 doesn't excist , and neither in one of the other books. So....
Grethe
Thyholm,Vang, Gislum,Hornum,Hindsted, Slet, Års i Aalborg a. Ginding,Ringkøbing a.Rinds, Fjends,Hindborg,Viborg a. Nybøl, Sottrup,Sønderbog a.sogne i Tyskland, Sunds,Svendborg a.Tuse,Års,Løve i Holbæ