Gødt nytår til alle. I ran across this police registration. http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3307866&searchname=polit_simple. I am trying to help another person trace Elly Larsine Elisabeth, født 26 Oct 1897. I have checked the Valby and den kgl fødelsskiftelse with no luck. I know that Ludvig Henrik was adopted by Christian Berthelsen and that Peter Marinus was the son of one of his daughters.
Elly emigrated to the USA in 1909 with Ludvig Henrik and it says she is his sister. In the 1910 census for Omaha, Nebraska Ludvig is listed as the brother of Dagmar and Elly as her cousin.
Any help or suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Med venlig hilsen
Paul
You find the family in FT 1901 Smedestraede 10, image 18. Peter Marinius is the son of Anna Louise B.
Ft 1906 the same adress, image 21. There is no Elly living there. C. Berthelsen owns the house. There is also a brother and his family living at the same adress.
Eva M
http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3307857&searchname=polit_simple
The wife's registerblade. She died shortly after her husband.
Eva M
You find Peter M. J. birth in Valby (1892-1901), image 94. Perhaps Elly is the daughter of Dagmar.
Eva M
http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=1983999&searchname=polit_simple
Ludvig H. B. came back from the US.
Eva M
http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=2053624&searchname=polit_simple
Dagmar's registerblade.
Eva M
Hi
http://www.sa.dk/ao/andre/SkifteKom.aspx
Embede: Københavns Skiftekommision indtil 1919
Navn: Hvidebog
1909-1910
Christian Berthelsen : Opslag 207
Augusta Mathilde Berthelsen born Jensen :Opslag 304-307
--
Elly is not mentioned.
Hej Eva og Flemmimg,
Perhaps the answer lies in the American records. Since Elly was 13 in the 1910 census perhaps she was confirmed in 1911 in the Norwegian-Danish Evangelical Lutheran Church in Omaha, Nebraska.
Thanks for all your efforts.
Med venlig hilsen
Paul
Hello,
Paul was assisting me in finding information on Elly. She is my great grandmother. I am trying to track her time in Denmark and hoping to find her parents.
In the first link given in this forum : http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3307866&searchname=polit_simple.
The address translated to Wrought Strait 10, first.
Google maps is not able to find this address, so I am wondering if it translated correctly.
Thank you to anyone who can assist me.
Trisha
Hi Trisha,
The street name is, as you can see to the right of the paper: Smedestræde 10.
On www.maps.google.com write Smedestraede 10, Valby, Denmark.
Lissa
Hi Trisha.
On the police registration you can find a link: Vis adresser på kort (beta)
It's only a beta version but it's ok for Smedestræde.
The address is marked with an A in a balloon. Attached
Verner
[vedhæfting slettet af admin]
Mange tak Verner.
Med venlig amerikanske hilsener
Paul
The family (Christian Bertelsen and Augusta living with Christian's parents) is here in 1880:
kbhv, Sokkelund, Hvidovre, Valby, , Smedestræde 10, et Hus, , FT-1880
Name: Age: Marital status: Occupation in household: Occupation: Birth place:
Bertel Madsen 58 Gift Husfader, Handelsmand Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Katrine Madsen f. Petersen 54 Gift hans Hustru Brøndbyøster sogn, Københavns amt
Hans Peter Bertelsen 16 Ugift deres Barn Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Julius Martin Bertelsen 14 Ugift deres Barn Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Ludvig Hendrik Bertelsen 11 Ugift deres Barn Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Christian Bertelsen 22 Gift deres Barn, Arbejdsmand Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Augusta Bertelsen f. Jensen 20 Gift hans Hustru Fredeiksberg, Københavns amt
Anna Bertelsen 1 Ugift deres Barn Hvidovre sogn, Københavns amt
Christine Hendrichsen 16 Ugift Tyende Smørumovre by og sogn, Københavns amt
Christian and Augusta married 17 November 1878 in Copenhagen (but where) - according to Familysearch.
They married 17 November 1878 in Hvidovre (1875-1891), opslag 17!
Their daughter Anna Lovise Annette Bertelsen is born 26 Jan 1879 in Hvidovre (1877-1885), opslag 106
A daughter Berta Jensine Katrine Bertelsen was born 15 July 1880 in Hvidovre (1877-1885), opslag 123
Lissa
Is Jensen Augusta's maiden name? I think possibly that is Elly's blood relative.
Yes, that's her maiden name.
f. Jensen means born Jensen.
Lissa
A boy Emil Charles Bertelsen was born 10 Jan 1891 in Hvidovre, opslag 72 (1885-1891) to Hans Peter Bertelsen and Marie Christine Bentsen - they lived at Smedestræde 10.
Witnesses:
widow Cathrine Elisabeth Bertelsen
merchant Christian Bertelsen and his wife
all of Valby, Smedestræde 10
the parents
Hans Peter was Christian's and Ludvig Henrik's brother.
This is Hans Peter's death: http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3307876&searchname=polit_simple
His wife Marie Christine is here (as a widow): http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=2489972&searchname=polit_simple
Lissa
Here is a daughter Katrine Elisabeth Bertelsen - born 11 April 1886 to Hans Peter Bertelsen (Hvidovre 1885-1891, opslag 97): http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=2489945&searchname=polit_simple
Christian Bertelsen and his wife were also witnesses at her birth.
Lissa
Tusind tak :D
Do you have any other clues how to find Elly's birth
Just for info: Valby parish was separated from Hvidovre parish 1 May 1902.
Jesuskirken in Valby parish: http://www.jesuskirken.dk/Historie,-arkitektur-og-instrumenter.3.aspx
Lissa
Dagmar Berthine Mathilde Bertelsen was born 28 Sep 1884 in Hvidovre parish, opslag 180 (1877-1885). This time the family wasw living Smedestræde 7.
I don't think she could be the mother of Elly - as mentioned earlier - as she would only have been around 13 yrs old (in 1897).
Lissa
According to FamilySearch.org:
Augusta Mathilde Jensen born Apr 9, 1860
Parents:
Jens Olsen
Sidse Kirstine Larsen
Sisters:
Anna Margrethe Jensen born Aug 26, 1855
Ane Kirstine Jensen born Jul 19, 1862
Birth records:
Augusta Mathilde = 1859-1863 Frederiksberg ops 190 #59
Anna Margrethe = 1853-1859 Frederiksberg ops 188 #79
Ane Kirstine = 1853-1871 Hvidovre ops 159 #25
Although the father's name is different, I believe this census shows the family in 1860:
København, Sokkelund, Frederiksberg, Allégade, , Gaarden nr. 8, 155 - F4, FT-1860
Jens Jensen 40 Gift Arbejdsmand Havdrup Sogn, Roskilde Amt
Sisse Christine Jensen, f. Larsen 28 Gift Hustru Skævinge Sogn, Frederiksborg Amt
Ane Margrethe Jensen 5 Ugift Datter Frederiksberg
I don't have many clues about Elly's birth. We always knew her last name as Fredericksen. We never knew about her last name of Berthelsen or Bertelsen until we found her confirmation certificate which listed her as Berthelsen. That is when we found her ship record. The other mystery, is she told her children that she traveled to America alone, however she is listed as traveling with someone (we assume a cousin) on the ship record. She did not like the family she came to live with, so that may be a reason she said she traveled alone.
Her U.S. social security application gives her name as Elly Fredericksen (maiden name), Karaus (married). Her birth date as Oct 22 1896. (so there is some discrepancy with her birth date).
Her father's name is listed as Jens Fredericksen and mother Caroline. (The spelling of her mother's name could be different, because it looks like Cavoline. Where the "v" is it looks as if they had typed over a letter, or tried to back up as if they typed it incorrectly).
At some point we have her parents listed as,
father: Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen and
mother: Kirstine Ane Jensen, but I am not sure from what source we have this information. We also know she had a brother, but we do not know his name. He joined some type of military, but we do not know when or who he joined with. We only have one picture of him, and a couple of drawings he did.
I always questioned her father's name being Frederiksen as well, since this was about the time the region the children used their father's first name as their last name.
Lissa,
Thanks for the info on the separation of Valby. That will be interesting to read up on.
http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3321721&searchname=polit_simple (http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3321721&searchname=polit_simple)
I'm checking out this Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen as the possible father of Elly. He and his wife Anna Christine both died in 1899. It appears that Anna Christine is the sister of Augusta Matilde Berthelsen.
I found her birth record in 1892-1900 Skt Paul (ops 31, #194)! Elly Elisabeth Larsine Frederiksen. It even mentions the name Bertelsen. Hopefully one of the Danes will translate it for you.
Oh my!! Thank you everyone thus far for helping me. We have had this brick wall for the longest time, and I have just recently had some time to sit down and start trying to dive in and search for clues.
This has been a really big big help!
Would there have been any death records or obituaries for Jens Peter and Ane Kirstine (or Anna Christine) which would give a reason for their deaths?
The death of Ane Christine - København, Vor Frue 1892-1914, ops. 180, no 23.
Skt Paul 1892-1900, opslag 316, # 194:
1896, 22 Octbr. Roseng. 12,1.
P. Olsen [name of midwife?]
Elly Elisabeth Larsine Frederiksen
Bertelsen kgl. Bevill. af 19/12 07
Frederiksen, Jens Peter Hans, Arbejdsmand
H. Ane Kirstine Jensen, 33
Adoptivforældre: Husejer Christian Bertelsen
og Hustru Augusta Mathilde Jensen
18 Novbr. 1896 Lützhøft i Hjemmet
fremstillet i Kirken 8. August 1897
Bud Lars Frederiksen og Hustru Elisabeth
Frederiksg. 21
ugift Christian Christiansen, Roseng. 12
Viede 2/8 91 Danmark
Best regards,
Inger Toudal
Great with the birth of Elly!
So, her mother Ane Kirstine Jensen = 1853-1871 Hvidovre ops 159 #25 definitely must be the sister of Augusta Mathilde Jensen.
This is the death of Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen - 14 Aug 1899: http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3321721&searchname=polit_simple
Lissa
Great find John,
How did you find Elly's birth, and how do I get there?
What is Skt Paul?
"I found her birth record in 1892-1900 Skt Paul (ops 31, #194)! Elly Elisabeth Larsine Frederiksen. It even mentions the name Bertelsen. Hopefully one of the Danes will translate it for you."
Hi Trisha
Skt Paul 1892-1900, opslag 316, # 194:
It is the churchrecord for her birth and christening - and you find it on:
http://www.sa.dk/ao/SoegeSider/Kirkeboeger.aspx
Amt (county) = København
Sogn (parish) = Skt. Paul
Hi Trisha,
Go to www.arkivalieronline.dk (instructions for use: www.utilis.dk).
Then click "Kirkebøger" (= church books) and then "Søg i kirkebøger" (= search the church books) - next step in county choose "København", next district "Sokkelund" and finally "Skt. Paul". Now find 1892-1900 and click to download (you need Java!) - and then find the opslag No. 316 and #194.
I hope this works!
Lissa
Note - its ops. 316 !
This could be Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen with parents and sister in 1880:
kbhv, København (Staden), Farvergade, Farvergade 19, 137, , 85, FT-1880
Name: Age: Marital status: Occupation in household: Occupation: Birth place:
Lars Frederiksen 40 Gift Husfader Bud (tender) Ousted Sogn !!
Anna Elisabeth Frederiksen 42 Gift Hans Kone Farum Sogn, Frederiksborg Amt
Jens Peder Hans Frederiksen 13 Ugift Deres Søn København
Anna Margrethe Frederiksen 9 Ugift Deres Datter København
And he could be here in 1885 with mother (married) and sister:
kbhv, København (Staden), Lille Istedgade (Lige numre), Kjøbenhavn Udenbys Vester Kvarter, , Lille Istedgade 6,matr.221 Forhus 2.Sal, 27, FT-1885
Name: Age: Marital status: Occupation in household: Occupation: Birth place:
Ane Elisabet Frederiksen 47 Gift Husmoder Farum Soven wrong spelling = sogn = parish),Frederiksborg
Jens Peder Frederiksen 18 Ugift Barn Bagersvend (baker) Kjøbenhavn
Ane Maghrete (wrong spelling!) Frederiksen 14 Ugift Barn Tjenneste Kjøbenhavn
Lars is here in 1885:
kbhv, København (Staden), Frederiksholms Kanal (Lige numre), Kjøbenhavn Vester Kvarter, , Frederiksholms Kanal 18,matr.242B Forhus 2.Sal, 5, FT-1885
Name: Age: Marital status: Occupation in household: Occupation: Birth place:
Emil Zeuthen Svitzer 79 Gift Husfader Grosserer Reerslev
Ida Christine Svitzer 77 Gift Husmoder Kjøbenhavn
Elise Amalie Henriette Erika Petersen 28 Ugift Tyende Korsør
Kirsten Marie Jensen 33 Ugift Tyende Engelstrup
Bodil Christine Petersen 34 Ugift Tyende Vexebo
Lars Frederiksen 45 Gift Tyende (servant) Ousted
Christian Lorentzen 29 Ugift Tyende Holbæk
Thorvald Christiansen 33 Ugift Tyende Høireby
Here you will find both Lars Frederiksen's and Ane Elisabeth's deaths: http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3321805&searchname=polit_simple
Lissa
On this website you can read memories (if you can translate from Danish) of people having lived in Valby, and you will also find a very nice old photo from Valby Langgade showing at the far left end the corner of Smedestraede: http://www.erindringer.dk/valby
The photo is from around 1910.
You will also to the right find a map section of Valby from 1896.
Lissa
The 1901 Census (Ny Kongensgade ops 62) and the 1906 Census (Ny Kongensgade ops 60) show that Lars Frederiksen had a "sønensøn" named Hjalmar Fernando Frederiksen living with them. He was born Jan 29, 1893 in Frederikshavn. Could he be Elly's brother?
His birth record is 1892-1896 Frederikshavn, Horns, Hjørring ops 23. His parents are Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen and Ane Kirstine Jensen!
Here is the 1890 census showing Jens Peter Hans working as a stoker on a fishing boat.
Hjørring, Horns, Frederikshavn Købstad, Skibe i Havnen, , "Frederikshavn", , FT-1890
Magnus Christiansen 22 Ugift Fisker Elling Sogn, Hjørring Amt
Jens Peder Pedersen 16 Ugift Fisker Elling Sogn, Hjørring Amt
Niels Chr. Jensen 56 Gift Maskinmester Frederikshavn
Marius Anton Carl Mikkelsen 27 Ugift Maskinmester Skive
Axel Heinrich Bumasballe 22 Ugift Tømmerman Birkerød Sogn, Frederiksborg Amt
Jens Peter Hans Frederiksen 23 Ugift Fyrbøder Kjøbenhavn
Jens Nielsen 20 Ugift Barn Fisker Frederikshavn
Elly's maternal grandmother was born Sidse Kirstine Larsdatter (May 31, 1832). Her birth is recorded in the Skævinge, Strø, Frederiksborg churchbook (ops 79).
Here she is in the 1840 census:
Frederiksborg, Strø, Skævinge, skjævinge bye, , huus, 58, FT-1840
Lars Magnussen 47 Gift arbejdsmand
Ellen Nielsdtr. 39 Gift konen.
Ole Larsen 13 Ugift deres børn
Sidse Kirstine Larsdtr. 8 Ugift do
Hans Larsen 4 Ugift do
Hi Trisha,
Maybe you could do with a translation of Elly's birth and baptismal record?
København, Sokkelund, Skt Paul 1892-1900, opslag 316, # 194:
[birth date and place]
1896, 22 Oct. Rosengade 12, 1st floor
P. Olsen [name of midwife?]
[name of the child]
Elly Elisabeth Larsine Frederiksen
Bertelsen Royal permission dated 19 Dec. 1907
[parents]
Frederiksen, Jens Peter Hans, worker
wife Ane Kirstine Jensen, 33 y
Adoptive parents: houseowner Christian Bertelsen
and wife Augusta Mathilde Jensen
[baptism]
18 Nov. 1896 Lützhøft at home
presented in church 8 Aug. 1897
[witnesses]
Delivery man Lars Frederiksen and wife Elisabeth
Frederiksgade 21
unmarried Christian Christiansen, Rosengade 12
[remarks]
Married 2 Aug. 1891 Denmark
You can type Rosengade in this link to see a map where the street is marked:
http://www.fogsgaard.org/index.php/kobenhavnske-gader
About Saint Paul's Church, Copenhagen:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Paul%27s_Church,_Copenhagen
http://www.sanktpauls.dk/
Best regards,
Inger T.
Lissa and Judith, I was able to get onto www.arkivalieronline.dk. My mom and I are looking for Elly now!
John was able to find Jens Peter Hans working as a stoker on a fishing boat. Does anyone know what a stoker is?
Also, what is the purpose for the two middle names?
Inger,
Thank you for the translation. That did help a lot.
I will become an expert in Danish soon by continuing my research on a regular basis!
John, I think you may have found Elly's brother!
Trisha,
Having looked at the censuses 1901 and 1906, which John refers to, I realized that I gave you the wrong translation for Lars Frederiksen's profession. In the censuses his occupation is Kontorbud, i.e. 'messenger', not delivery man.
In Elly's birth record his profession is Bud, which could be translated both ways.
If you would like to look up the censuses yourself:
http://www.sa.dk/ao/ -> Folketællinger -> Søg i folketællinger -> FT-1901 (or FT-1906) -> København -> Ny Kongensgade -> Click "Hent oplysninger"
Stoker 'person whose job is to stoke fires, especially on a ship or a steam train' (stoke 'add coal or wood to a fire').
Best regards,
Inger T.
Thank you for the update and the further explanations, Inger.
So far in this research in this forum, we see that the last name Frederiksen is carried through three different generations instead of the child taking their father's first name as their last?
Do either of these sites give reason of death, provide their burial site, or offer any type of information surrounding their death (besides dates)?
There are is for Jens Peter Hans Fredericksen, and his wife Ane Kirstine Jensen.
http://www.politietsregisterblade.dk/index.php?option=com_sfup&controller=politregisterblade&task=viewRegisterblad&id=3321721&searchname=polit_simple
The death of Ane Christine - København, Vor Frue 1892-1914, ops. 180, no 23.
Thanks